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> DAVID: [i]Shapiro was president of his Temple. [/i]-dhw: [i]Thank you. So there is one theist who is not joining you.[/i]-DAVID: [i]What Shapiro thinks privately and what he produces scientifically may not be what you think. In his career he deals with atheistic superiors. His read/write approach to how cells work may be attributed to God in his personal thoughts. That is how I interpret his work.[/i]-Shapiro&apos;s belief that cells are sentient conscious beings (as opposed to automatons) is neither theistic nor atheistic. He can attribute their intelligence to God, and his atheistic superiors can attribute it to chance. My point is that he is a theist who does not share your belief that cells are automatons. (See also post on Spetner.)   dhw: [i]I asked about ID evolutionists, and if they accept common descent, they cannot possibly dismiss Darwin completely. [/i]-DAVID: [i]I sense that many of them do not accept common descent. Many don&apos;t like theistic evolution, and Tony&apos;s view may be prevalent.[/i]-I&apos;m not sure how much I can rely on your &#147;sense&#148;, but you do believe in common descent, and so even if you are right about the &#147;many&#148;, my question would relate to how many of the remaining few share your belief in a 3.8-billion-year programme/divine dabbling for all the innovations, lifestyles etc. But you have already answered that in such a way as to make it clear that even among the evolutionary ID-ers you consider to be your supporters, you are actually pretty isolated.