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> > DAVID: [i]But there must be a first cause. What is it? You decline to propose an answer[/i]. > dhw: [i]I have never declined to propose an answer, but have repeated over and over again the hypothesis we both subscribe to: namely, eternal energy. In your hypothesis it has always inexplicably been intelligent. In my alternative hypothesis it has ceaselessly transmuted itself into matter and vice versa, in the course of which intelligence has inexplicably evolved through matter.[/i] >  > DAVID: [i]Your view is that intelligence can evolve from matter which was formed from energy, all by itself. I view intelligence as the ability to gain knowledge, understand facts and then collate that material into reasonable conclusions. I agree your view is inexplicable. I cannot see how intelligence can evolve all by itself from some form of undescribed matter. Your own sharp intelligence requires 100 billion neurons and invented an inexplicable escape hatch.[/i] > -Speaking of eternal, intelligent energy, if there is such, and science tends to lean to the side there is, then how can that eternal intelligence be removed from any thing that is? If in fact this hypothesis is true, how can eternal intelligence be bottled, labeled and sold as separate entities such as planet, water, dog, bird, air, space etc,? What I am asking is, can intelligent energy be separated from itself? I think Sheldrake&apos;s work says no, it can&apos;t. Our eye says yes it can be separated since all things are separate, but is science removing that veil and revealing the truth?